The Tournament Director Forums
Main => Templates, Layouts and Sounds => Topic started by: coyote97 on August 03, 2007, 03:04:58 PM

OK, I've just started using this wonderful software. I love it and so do all the players that I play with. We are starting a new league tonight and I'm trying to figure out how get the software to award the points the way we would like. Here is what we would like to do:
Points are awarded to everyone that plays. For instance, 15 players, 1st place is worth 15 points, 2nd is 14 points etc.
Everyone in the money gets 1 point with first place getting 3 points. Usually pay 34 places.
Hitmen are awarded 1 point.
Bounty for prior tourney winner is 1 point.
If anyone can help me with setting this up I would really appreciate it. It certainly will help my credibility tonight! LOL!! :)

Let's break this down:
The first part, staggered points for playing, is easy: numberOfPlayers  rank + 1 (or n  r + 1)
For 1 bonus point for making the money: add inTheMoney (or m)
For 2 more bonus points for winning: add if(r=1, 2, 0) [i.e. 2 for 1st, 0 for any other position]
For 1 point per hit: add numberOfHits (or nh)
So that makes the formula: (n  r + 1) + m + if(r=1, 2, 0) + nh
Unfortunately, there's no variable for bounty of previous winner. You can define a prize for a bounty on a specific player and make it 1 point, but I don't think you can add the two easily.

You've got it right, Matt. Your formula takes care of everything except for the bounty on the previous winner. To take care of that part, do exactly what you suggested, create a prize that is a bounty on the previous winner, and give it a point value of 1. No need to give it a cash amount (set it to Nonmonetary).
Each player will get the points defined in the Points for Playing. The person who knocks out the previous winner will also win the bounty prize (of 1 point). Key word being also. So the player will get the sum of the Points for Playing and the bounty prize points.

Thanks guys. Excuse me for sounding ignorant. I'm obviously not a programmer. The formula gets typed exactly as Matt wrote it (n  r + 1) + m + if(r=1, 2, 0) + nh in the box that says points for playing? And if we want to use the bounty on the previous winner, I will need to choose that player every time we start the tournament?

Thanks guys. Excuse me for sounding ignorant. I'm obviously not a programmer. The formula gets typed exactly as Matt wrote it (n  r + 1) + m + if(r=1, 2, 0) + nh in the box that says points for playing? And if we want to use the bounty on the previous winner, I will need to choose that player every time we start the tournament?
Yes, copy and paste into the Points for Playing formula.
And yes, you have to choose the player the bounty is on, as TD has no way of knowing who won the previous tournament.

Thanks Matt. Huge help. One last question. I pasted your formula and did the test. It shows the first place winner earning 14 points. Shouldn't it be 15? 12 for finishing first in a twelve person tourney and 3 bonus points for first place?

Thanks Matt. Huge help. One last question. I pasted your formula and did the test. It shows the first place winner earning 14 points. Shouldn't it be 15? 12 for finishing first in a twelve person tourney and 3 bonus points for first place?
Check if you have the in the money variable set to 1.

I put 1 in there and now the top 3 positions are correct, but 412 are getting an extra point now.

I put 1 in there and now the top 3 positions are correct, but 412 are getting an extra point now.
That's just the way the test formula page works. Run a test tournament to see if everything works like you want it to.

Matt,
I just ran a couple of quick tournament tests and I think it's working how I want. I won every time I tested it. Can you imagine? Thanks for the help. As far as I'm concerned it should say hero under your name too! Helped me out a great deal and quick too! I owe you a drink!

Tournament went well last night. One small problem. Points were awarded for a hit even if the person rebought. We want to award the points only when the person was knocked out completely. How do I change the formula to do this? Also, I had the payouts being split by percentage and had the numbers rounded to the nearest dollar. The payout ended up being $1 more than the amount in the pot. Any way to fix that? Thanks again.
Dennis

The TD considers all bustouts as bustouts, regardless of whether or not the player buys back in. The only way to currently work around this is to not bust the player out  instead just rebuy the player.
The software won't automatically adjust your prizes to "fit" into your prize pool, when rounding is enabled. It can't  it couldn't possibly make a judgment call as to which prize ought to not be rounded should the prizes total to greater than the prize pool. But you can do it yourself. Edit the victim prize (the prize you'll be taking $1 from). You can either check the Amount checkbox in the Override section and enter what the prize amount should be (effectively overriding what the program calculates what the prize should be), or you can enter "1" in the Adjust by field in the Amount section, to adjust the prize amount down by $1.

The software won't automatically adjust your prizes to "fit" into your prize pool, when rounding is enabled. It can't  it couldn't possibly make a judgment call as to which prize ought to not be rounded should the prizes total to greater than the prize pool. But you can do it yourself. Edit the victim prize (the prize you'll be taking $1 from). You can either check the Amount checkbox in the Override section and enter what the prize amount should be (effectively overriding what the program calculates what the prize should be), or you can enter "1" in the Adjust by field in the Amount section, to adjust the prize amount down by $1.
I believe you can also choose the "round down" option, then decide which place(s) will share in any leftover money.

Corey, for the question on bust outs, can you put a negative value for rebuys thus evening out the point gained in bust out then rebuy?

If I understand you correctly, the answer would be no. The number of rebuys can't be adjusted (without performing or undoing a rebuy).

Corey and Matt,
Thanks again for your quick responses. I am going to have to change the way our league hands out hitman points so that the software will work for us. I don't think I will have any problem with players having a chance to earn more points. I took your suggestion on the $1 adjustment for the rounding problem. That's a good enough solution for me. Can't wait until the next tournament to run the software again!

I really like this formula. only commenting to save location
Let's break this down:
The first part, staggered points for playing, is easy: numberOfPlayers  rank + 1 (or n  r + 1)
For 1 bonus point for making the money: add inTheMoney (or m)
For 2 more bonus points for winning: add if(r=1, 2, 0) [i.e. 2 for 1st, 0 for any other position]
For 1 point per hit: add numberOfHits (or nh)
So that makes the formula: (n  r + 1) + m + if(r=1, 2, 0) + nh
Unfortunately, there's no variable for bounty of previous winner. You can define a prize for a bounty on a specific player and make it 1 point, but I don't think you can add the two easily.

Hi, totally new to all this and I would really appreciate some help for a formula.
This is how we would like to set it up.
20 points for buying in
3 points for hit
3 points for rank (every position till the winner)
additional points for inthemoney. Now this may vary depending on number of players in tournament.
So, this is our idea:
4 prizes  30, 20, 10, 5 (additional points)
3 prizes  20, 10, 5 (additional points)
2 prizes  10, 5 (additional points)
(so the winner in a tournament of 20 players would have the following points assuming that he has busted out all players by himself. 20 (buyin) + 19x3 (hit) + 19x3 (rank) + 30 (for 1st prize when 4 prizes are given).
I hope this is understandable and like I said.. would truly appreciate someones help on this to create the perfect formula.

Ok,
The game screen will take care of the "points for buyin" and "points for hits", just make sure you enter the corresponding values in the game options.
The formula for giving 3 points for every rank is: (nr)*3 (this is if you want your last player to get 0 pts otherwise you have to use ((nr)+1)*3 then EVERYBODY will get at least 3 points.
The formula for "in the money" bonuses is: if(r<=mr, if(r=mr, 5, (mrr)*10), 0) which reads, if the Rank is below MoneyRank add 0 else if the Rank is equal to MoneyRank then add 5 points else add the subtraction of the actual Rank from the MoneyRank and multilply by 10.
So the end formula should be:
(nr)*3 + if(r<=mr, if(r=mr, 5, (mrr)*10), 0)
HTH
Lafrog

I would suggest including the points for buyin and points for hits in the formula itself, just to keep it all in one place:
(nr)*3 + if(r<=mr, if(r=mr, 5, (mrr)*10), 0) + 20 + (nh * 3)
Of course, that's really down to personal preference, as it will yield the same results.

Thanks for your quick reply and help.
Will this formula take into consideration how many moneyspots that are available for that tournament?
/T

The variable mr is the "moneyRank", which will automatically be set to the highest rank with a rankbased prize. That is, if you have prizes for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place, then mr will be 3. If you have prizes for 1st through 10th place, then mr will be 10.

The variable mr is the "moneyRank", which will automatically be set to the highest rank with a rankbased prize. That is, if you have prizes for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place, then mr will be 3. If you have prizes for 1st through 10th place, then mr will be 10.
That is unless your field decide to work a deal and add say another prize to the prizepool. I believe that if you reflect that wish and create another prize (from money taken off the already set prizes) that this will change the value of mr thus the point value attributed to your players.
Lafrog

Once again thanks for your quick and accurate reply.
My final question (for this time). Can I apply this formula to an already completed tournament? I have saved the tournament as a template so I have all the info left. I would like to add the formula, fire up the old tournament and then export it.
Would that work or will it only be for the coming tournaments?

I've now run a test on the formula.
Problem is that the first part for ranking is giving me negative values. The first person out of the tournament will only get 20 points for buyin. Second one out will get 20+3 (buyin + rank)
Say with 27 buyin the first person out gets 20 + (81) = 61
What do I need to change in order to only get positive points for all players?

The only way this formula can produce negative number is if youn have more money rank than actual ranks (players)...
What is the formula you are using?
Lafrog

When I test the formula provided by you it gives me negative numbers for players in tournament director.
Not sure that Statsgenie are getting the numbers correct but when I export a test tournament and import it into statsgenie it will give roughly 68 points to the winner and 65 something for last position.
( I used the formula provided by Corey: (nr)*3 + if(r<=mr, if(r=mr, 5, (mrr)*10), 0) + 20 + (nh * 3)
)

Once again thanks for your quick and accurate reply.
My final question (for this time). Can I apply this formula to an already completed tournament? I have saved the tournament as a template so I have all the info left. I would like to add the formula, fire up the old tournament and then export it.
Would that work or will it only be for the coming tournaments?
Yes. Any change made to any tournament, whether the tournament hasn't started, is currently running, or is over, will cause the *entire* tournament state to be recomputed. So you can make a change at any time. Just remember to save it after you make the change.

When I test the formula provided by you it gives me negative numbers for players in tournament director.
Not sure that Statsgenie are getting the numbers correct but when I export a test tournament and import it into statsgenie it will give roughly 68 points to the winner and 65 something for last position.
( I used the formula provided by Corey: (nr)*3 + if(r<=mr, if(r=mr, 5, (mrr)*10), 0) + 20 + (nh * 3)
)
If you're testing the formula in the Test Formula dialog, you need to make sure you give each of the variables in the formula an appropriate value. The test dialog allows you to provide just about ANY value, whether or not they would realistically be found in an actual tournament. This can lead to confusing results. And most values are simply zero by default, which isn't valid for some variables (like rank). A good way to test is to load an already completed tournament, make a change to the formula, and go to the Players tab to see what points are actually awarded. Likewise, after loading a tournament, in the test formula dialog press the Set from Tournament button to fill in real values from the tournament. Do this in both the "Test Conditions" section and the "Player Information" section.
As an example, the default "Tournament Scores" formula (on the Stats tab) is log((n + 1) / r). If you test this formula and fail to assign the r variable a value, the formula result will be "error", because "rank" (r) will have a default value of zero, and you can't divide by zero. But there's nothing wrong with the formula. In a tournament, no one can rank "0" so that error will never happen.

Once again. Big thanks for all the help!
It all worked and I was even able to apply this to an already finished tournament.
Appreciate the support! (whenever you Corey end up in Sweden... I guess I owe you a beer!)

I use this
assign("totalPlayersExpense", addOnCost + buyinCost + rebuyCost)
assign("playerProfitability", buyinCost/totalPlayersExpense)
assign("SquartRootFunction", SQRT (buyins * buyincost * playerProfitability))
SquartRootFunction/(rank + 1)* 100