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Main => Help Me => Topic started by: Rassal on June 19, 2010, 12:33:59 AM

Title: Penality for a player that didn't show up...
Post by: Rassal on June 19, 2010, 12:33:59 AM
It's the 1st time it happens, and i dunno how to do it...

Our rules stipulate that when you don't advise at least 8-12 hours in advance that you won't show up at a game, you lose 5 points on the overall score...

So i have a tournament where i have 11 players, but only 10 show up and buy-in. THe 11th player, i want to give him a -5 point on that tournament that will sum up on the overall score... i tried handing him a prize with a -5 point, but it shows on points, not on overall score...

I don't want to penalize the player with a played tournament either, because he didn't played (we sum the 6 best tournament out of 12...)

Title: Re: Penality for a player that didn't show up...
Post by: Corey Cooper on June 19, 2010, 04:24:02 PM
Add the player to the tournament, but don't buy the player into the tournament.  On the Players tab, edit the player and set the points adjustment to -5.  This adjustment will show up in the Stats.
Title: Re: Penality for a player that didn't show up...
Post by: Rassal on June 20, 2010, 06:39:43 AM
I already tried that, but it doesn't work....

Here's the result in the stats tab when i refresh the tournaments for the season, we have played 5 tournament as we speak, and this particular player played 4, and didn't show up on the 5th.

I made the modification in the tournament, by adding the player to the tournament, without a buy-in for him and ajusting his points by -5.

This is the result in the player stats, you can clearly see the ajustement and the overall score not being deducted 5 points...

Now something works somewhere, go back to 1st screenshot, and you will see that he's 9th (the position he should be with 11.6 points), but according to his 16.6 points, he should be 8th, but the 8th player has 16.28 points, so somehow, it gets calculated, but the score does't reflect reality....

I am using this formula on a tournament (points for playing) to calculate score :  (sqrt(((n * bc) * (bc / tc))) / (r + 1.0))+(nh*(nh+1)/10)

And i am using this to calculate overall score for the league:

Tournament Scoring formula: points
Overall Scoring formula: sum(top(6, scores))

I think i cannot be more clear... what's wrong on my side?

His real score should be 11.6, as he had 16.6 points before not showing up and the penality rule apply to him. Now that i deducted the -5 points by adding him to the tournament without buying-him in, the points reflect the -5, but not the overall score... and we use the overall score to track everything on stats genie, so the penality doesn't get exported and he's not ranked correctly.

Title: Re: Penality for a player that didn't show up...
Post by: Corey Cooper on June 21, 2010, 11:04:58 AM
Actually, it does work, but just not to the degree you are expecting.  The ability to penalize a player by adjusting his or her points and/or winnings in a tournament in which the player did not actually participate, and have it affect their stats, was added specifically for that narrow purpose.  It does not have the broader implications you are expecting.  Sorry if I implied that.  Frankly, it's kind of a hack, meant to assist in a very special case, albeit one that is somewhat common.

So, specifically, if you add a player to a tournament and adjust their points and/or winnings and do NOT buy the player in, the adjustments will show up in the stats as adjustments to the Points and/or Total Winnings columns (which are automatically summed).  It will NOT affect Tournament Score formulas that utilize the "points" variable.  The reason is that the Tournament Score value is not computed for a player who did not participate in the tournament.  If it did, then the player would then have an additional Score value, and that would (or could) ultimately affect the Overall Score formulas.  In your case it would be beneficial, but just to take a simple case of someone who had the Overall Score formula of "average(scores)", it would probably affect their expected results in a detrimental way (the sum would then be averaged by dividing by a larger number of tournaments).  There are probably a billion other variations that could be affected.

So, there's the gist of it.  My suggestion for your particular case is to not penalize the player by adjusting their points in a tournament in which they didn't participate, but rather to adjust their points in a tournament in which they DID participate.  That will probably give you a more expected outcome.

And just to clear up something about that first image: you noted that Benoit has 16.6 points, and is listed in 9th place, but should really be in 8th place, according to the "Pts" column.  I don't know what column this is, as you've obviously renamed the columns, but I can assure you it is not actually the "Points" column.  The reason I know this is that that column does not have a Sum value at the bottom (only an Avg value), and the Points column definitely has a Sum value.  I suspect you've renamed one of the Overall Score columns to "Pts".  Second, the "#" column isn't technically a ranking of anything - it's just a number indicating position in the current sorting of the listing.  The results you've displayed don't appear to be sorted by the "Pts" column, either, or else I would expect to see an arrow pointing down in the column header.  It's a little confusing because I don't see that arrow in any of the columns.  It could be that it's on one of the other columns and the column is too narrow to display the arrow, but it doesn't appear to be sorted by any of the visible columns (and that should not be possible).

By the way, awesome use of screenshots and graphics to get your point across.  It was very helpful.  You almost had me convinced just by the visuals alone.  This is a complicated topic, and to be honest I had to go back into the code to refresh my memory on why this wasn't working the way you had expected it to work.
Title: Re: Penality for a player that didn't show up...
Post by: macacan on June 22, 2010, 12:16:21 PM
He can not do what you suggest Corey.

I have the same problem and have been watching this thread like a hawk.

If he adjusted the score of a game that the player had played in, then when it totaled up the
players best scores it would not include this, I think.

I am just waiting to the end of the season then adjust his final score.

 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)

Title: Re: Penality for a player that didn't show up...
Post by: Corey Cooper on June 23, 2010, 10:09:59 AM
It depends on which game is used to adjust the player's score.  It might be part of a tournament score that is dropped, or it might cause a tournament score to be dropped.  In these cases it might not have the intended effect.

What probably needs to happen is a way to adjust Overall Scores.  I'll look into making adjustments in the filter.