Author Topic: Bounties All-ins and Blind Issues arising, and a few questions....  (Read 3194 times)

Radium

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 47
    • View Profile
How do Bounties and bounty chips work, I sort of understand the concept but not sure on the dynamics?

Also I have a few issues that keep arising from time to time.  ???

An example say the Blinds are 200/400 can the first person under the gun come in and make it 500 with their first bet or do they have to double the blind from 400 to 800 if they want to raise?

Next issue

Say the blinds are 1000/2000 Now if somebody goes all in and they have 1500, does the next person to bet have to still enter the pot for the full bet of 2000 and make a side pot of $500? or can they just call the all in even if there were several people still to act?

Next issue

If someone  raises a 1000 the next person calls that then the person after that goes all in with 1500 can next person re raise that or can they only call their all in? or what if they want to go all-in also... Can they? Then the person who raised it 1000, wants to re raise the all in, this happened last night and I wouldn't let them as he had already raised and I would only let him call the all in. Was that right?

Coloring up

Chip race, do you always race the chips when coloring or chipping up, or do you just change the smaller chip to the next closed denomination in play?

Antes

I have been deciding whether to use antes does any one play with Antes in the later stages of the Tourny, what size tournys would you usually use them for?


If somebody acts out of turn, do they still have to make that bet or action. Sometimes people act out of turn then when they see what the person in front of them does  they take their bet back? I don't feel that this should be allowed?

Thanks for your input

Phaze

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 346
    • View Profile
Re: Bounties All-ins and Blind Issues arising, and a few questions....
« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2008, 07:26:34 AM »
wow, lots of questions, I don't have much time but I'll try to get at em all

First suggestion: This is the most common source of poker rules anywhere

now, to you questions, as I understand the rules, and I'm not an expert so anyone go ahead and correct me if I'm wrong!

1. How do Bounties and bounty chips work, I sort of understand the concept but not sure on the dynamics?

A bounty is basically a game inside a game, and in this case it is like an inside bet at who is the best player in the tournament. You pay for a bounty chip and what you pay goes towards paying your bounty. If you get knocked out of the tournament then the person that knocked you out gets your bounty chip. At the end of the game (usually) the player with all the bounty chips can cash them in for the money that went to purchase those chips. Mind you there are different variations of this bounty game, but mainly its just like playing murder wink while you are playing a game of Clue (I believe its called Cluedo in Britain).

2. the Blinds are 200/400 can the first person under the gun come in and make it 500 with their first bet or do they have to double the blind from 400 to 800 if they want to raise?

This one I'm not 100% on but because the blinds are in (thus a fulfillment of a bet) I would say that yes they should double the blind here. Mind you, at the home game I play at we are bit relaxed on the rules so we don't keep this too seriously, but I think you would have to do a minimum of 800

3. Say the blinds are 1000/2000 Now if somebody goes all in and they have 1500, does the next person to bet have to still enter the pot for the full bet of 2000 and make a side pot of $500? or can they just call the all in even if there were several people still to act?

no, the next person would have to call the blind, because that bet is on the table already, not the all in 1500. So you would make the side pot of 500. Now if this scenario took place with the Big Blind only having 1500 I believe the bet would be at 1500 and not at 2000 because the chips are not on the table, but you would have to read that suggestion I made at the top there for more complete understanding of the rules

4. If someone  raises a 1000 the next person calls that then the person after that goes all in with 1500 can next person re raise that or can they only call their all in? or what if they want to go all-in also... Can they?

I'm assuming this is NL hold em so yes the next person after the all in can re-raise and/or go all in themselves. In No Limit Holdem anytime you are in a hand and its your turn to make a decision, you can bet as much as you want so long as you make the minimum bet. I think that the minimum bet rule is in place only to speed the game up so people don't get into slow betting wars.

5. Chip race, do you always race the chips when coloring or chipping up, or do you just change the smaller chip to the next closed denomination in play?

Its your home game, and so long as your rules are posted somewhere, you can do anything you want. Or at least make sure everybody knows the rules. My group, for example, have never done a chip race. If a person has left over chips then they are "donated" to the bank... Yeah it can be a bit unfair, but its only a very small percentage of your stack and I doubt it will break the bank on ya

6. Antes

I believe that antes at home game cause unnecessary confusion and slow down the play somewhat. An ante is in play to subtly make chip stacks smaller where as a blind level increase will dramatically make chip stacks depreciate. Basically its your call on whether you want them or not. I would say no.

7. If somebody acts out of turn, do they still have to make that bet or action. Sometimes people act out of turn then when they see what the person in front of them does  they take their bet back? I don't feel that this should be allowed?

In a casino if you act out of turn the dealer will let you know that you are  doing bad, at first. I think they could kill your hand if you continue to do it, but not sure. At our home game only the person who's turn it is plays. If someone acts out of turn they are told that its not their turn and attention is back to the proper player. I look at it as a computer program looks at its instruction, one step at a time. If a person tries to make a bet when its not his turn, you proceed like nothing happened. Then when it is their turn they can make their decision at that time, and they may decide that their out of position decision wasn't so hot after all.




Corey Cooper

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6220
    • View Profile
Re: Bounties All-ins and Blind Issues arising, and a few questions....
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2008, 12:40:02 PM »
How do Bounties and bounty chips work, I sort of understand the concept but not sure on the dynamics?

Bounty chips are chips that are purchased at the time of buy-in.  Usually, part of the buy-in goes toward the bounty chip, with the rest going to the pot.  This means that typically everyone buying into the tournament gets a bounty chip, but it can be made optional.

When a player busts out, he must give his bounty chip to the person who knocked them out of the tournament.  At the end of the tournament, players turn in the bounty chips they have collected for the money that was set aside at the buy-in.

For example, a tournament may have a $50 buy-in, with each player receiving a bounty chip worth $5.  That means that $5 of the buy-in goes to the "bounty chip pot", and the remaining $45 goes to the main pot.  When a player knocks someone else out of the tournament, he collects the busted-players bounty chip.  When a player busts-out, he gives up only the bounty chip he received at buy-in, not any he has collected during the tournament.  At the end of the tournament, he player who has bounty chips turns them in for $5 each.

This gives players an incentive to play a little looser when there is a chance to bust someone out of the tournament.  If I play in a 100-player tournament for $50, with a $5 bounty chip, I can still get my money back by busting out 10 other players - even if I place only, say, 85th, overall.

Also I have a few issues that keep arising from time to time.  ???

An example say the Blinds are 200/400 can the first person under the gun come in and make it 500 with their first bet or do they have to double the blind from 400 to 800 if they want to raise?

Most of the answers to your following questions will vary from tournament to tournament.  But I'd say the typical answer is that each raise must be at least the amount of the big blind.  Some people like to restrict raises to multiples of the big blind, but usually it's just that a raise must be at least the amount of the BB.  So, in your example, the first person under the gun would have to call $400, since the blinds would have already been in play, and therefore if he were to raise, he must raise to $800.  He could raise to $900 if he wanted.

Next issue

Say the blinds are 1000/2000 Now if somebody goes all in and they have 1500, does the next person to bet have to still enter the pot for the full bet of 2000 and make a side pot of $500? or can they just call the all in even if there were several people still to act?

Yes.  Since the BB is $2000, each player must at least call the $2000 to stay in the hand.  A player with only $1500 may bet all-in.  His $1500 goes into the main pot.  The remaining players must still call $2000 (or raise, of course) in order to remain in the hand - because the bet is still $2000 (remember, the blinds have already bet, technically).  $1500 of each player's bet goes to the main pot - including the blinds (which means $500 of the BB will be moved from the main pot into the side pot) - with the remaining $500 (or more if the bet is raised) going into a side pot.  The main pot is now halted, and all additional bets go into the side pot.  The $1500 all-in player can only win the main pot.  If someone besides the $1500 all-in player has the best hand, that player wins both pots.  If the $1500 all-in player has the best hand, he wins the main pot only.  The 2nd best hand wins the side pot.

If all remaining players fold (including the SB), this leaves the BB, who has bet $2000, and the all-in player who has bet $1500.  In this case, the BB removes $500 from the pot and places it back in their stack, and play continues.

Next issue

If someone  raises a 1000 the next person calls that then the person after that goes all in with 1500 can next person re raise that or can they only call their all in? or what if they want to go all-in also... Can they? Then the person who raised it 1000, wants to re raise the all in, this happened last night and I wouldn't let them as he had already raised and I would only let him call the all in. Was that right?

One thing to remember about no-limit: anyone can go all-in at any time.  It does not matter if they don't have enough chips to cover the bet, or if they have more chips than all of the other players combined.  So long as the player is in the hand, when their turn to bet comes, they may bet all-in.

Likewise, a player may re-raise at any time as well, as long as it makes sense, although some house rules may restrict this.  In most cases, if it is your turn to bet, you may bet/raise any amount you have, including all-in.

To take your example: the first player bets $1000, then the second calls, then the third goes all-in for $1500.  Assuming the blinds are $1000/$2000, the bet is actually now $2000.  The next player may fold, call $2000, raise to $3000 or more including all-in.  Assume he goes all-in for $5000.  The bet is now $5000.  If the next player only has $3000, he may also choose to go all-in for $3000.

The only issue here is keeping up with the side-pots, since in the case just described, you'll have the main pot and multiple side-pots.

Coloring up

Chip race, do you always race the chips when coloring or chipping up, or do you just change the smaller chip to the next closed denomination in play?

Antes

I have been deciding whether to use antes does any one play with Antes in the later stages of the Tourny, what size tournys would you usually use them for?


If somebody acts out of turn, do they still have to make that bet or action. Sometimes people act out of turn then when they see what the person in front of them does  they take their bet back? I don't feel that this should be allowed?

Thanks for your input

I'll let someone else chime in on the last ones.  I'm out of practice and have probably already messed something up...

Corey Cooper

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6220
    • View Profile
Re: Bounties All-ins and Blind Issues arising, and a few questions....
« Reply #3 on: July 09, 2008, 12:42:21 PM »
crisscross... well, at least Phaze and I are in agreement.  :)

badbeat

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 114
    • View Profile
Re: Bounties All-ins and Blind Issues arising, and a few questions....
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2008, 03:44:39 PM »
Normally, if someone acts out of turn their act will stand if the circumstances are the same, ie. if they call/raise out of turn and nobody raises before it gets to them, they are forced to make that act. If they call out of turn and someone raises before them, they are not forced to call because the situation has changed.

Playing out of turn is frowned upon, but mistakes happen, we're usually laid back about this in our games, but I know casinos etc. can impose penalties for repeat offenders.

Hope this helps and I haven't confused you even further.  :P

Radium

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 47
    • View Profile
Re: Bounties All-ins and Blind Issues arising, and a few questions....
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2008, 05:20:54 AM »
Thanks for you replies. Much appreciated! It's helped to clear up a few things.